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TOM WHEELER:

Welcome to the Econews Report. I'm your host this week, Tom Wheeler, Executive Director of EPIC. And I'm joined by my friend and co-host and colleague, Caroline Griffith, Executive Director of the North Coast Environmental Center. Hey, Caroline.

CAROLINE GRIFFITH:

Hi, Tom. Hi, everybody.

WHEELER:

So we are going to be talking about tribal energy sovereignty with an award winner, an upcoming award winner, Linnea Jackson, the general manager of the Hoopa Valley Public Utilities District, who is this year's 2023 Tribal Champion Award and is joining the Clean Energy Hall of Fame. So this is awarded by the California Energy Commission. Linnea, congratulations and welcome to the show.

LINNEA JACKSON:

Thank you so much. It's an absolute pleasure to be here. Again, my name is Linnea Jackson. I'm the general manager of Hoopa Public Utilities, and it's an absolute pleasure to be here with you both to talk about such important initiatives.

WHEELER:

So Hoopa Public Utilities, I take, is an arm of the Hoopa tribal government. Can you talk about what services you provide for residents in the Hoopa Valley?

JACKSON:

Sure. So Hoopa Public Utilities is a chartered entity of the tribe. We were established in 1982 firstly to provide domestic water services to the reservation. And so since then, over the last 42 years, we've expanded those services. So we provide U.S. safe drinking water. We provide irrigation services. We're charged with managing the hydrants for fire flow, fire protection. We operate the waste transfer station here. We're doing some major things in broadband. And now we're looking into the energy world as well. So we have a wide gamut of services and foundational utilities we provide for the reservation in our region.

GRIFFITH:

Well, and really like thinking about that, like all the those those foundational things, right, when you think about like city or municipality, right, the water, trash, electricity are just so important to how people live their day to day lives, right. And I wonder if you could talk a little bit about any of particularly when it comes to energy, the challenges because like as we're talking about here more towards the western parts of the county, there are a lot of constraints on our current electrical grid. So there are even those challenges to how do we electrify and how do we do that? Do you have those same challenges out there on the reservation?

JACKSON:

So particularly our region, we struggle with sustained and frequent power outages. Those can occur from EPSS events. We've had a couple of PSPS events. One thing about Northeastern Humboldt is that we're not served by the same electrical line as the coast. Really, our power comes from inland towards the Cottonwood area. So sometimes you guys might have your power restored, where we do not. And so we sometimes here, we'll have large weather events and there might be a snowfall where the weight of the snow snaps the trees. And so we'll have 19 power lines out. They have to come fly helicopters. We have people that struggle with being without power for a week or even two.

So that really impacts your ability to heat and cool depending on the weather. It affects medical devices. It attacks communications. It affects your ability to have those basic services. And so one thing that we're looking at is how can we address that with the current grid upgrades, with microgrid infrastructure, potentially small hydro. But energy is an underlying foundational utility that impacts everything from your broadband services to how our water pumps are operating, emergency communications for fire, the ambulance. It's an underlying critical need and something that we struggle with here and we're trying to find current solutions to.

WHEELER:

So I think you kind of talked about this or or have touched the major components in my mind, but folks who are listening might not be familiar with the idea of tribal energy sovereignty. Can you talk about as a Hoopa Valley citizen, as someone who manages a public utilities district for the tribe, what tribal energy sovereignty means to you and means to the tribe?

JACKSON:

So we talk about the word sovereignty, and obviously there's legal definitions of what that looks like. But I think coming from a tribal standpoint, it's going to look different for every single tribe. Some tribes are looking to own and operate their own electrical utility. Some want to partner and upgrade with existing investor-owned utilities, and some just want to have resiliency and programs available. So what we're currently working on in Hoopa is, for one, we need access to microgrids because we have these constant outages that happen. They bring in these large scale generators to kind of offset, because PG&E's substation is located in Hoopa, and that serves three tribal regions.

So it affects and impacts not only the Hoopa reservation, but the Yurok and the Karuk and all the downriver locations as well. So we're really trying to create a resilient, multifaceted program. So we also know that in the state of California, we pay the highest rates. We're looking at some homes are completely all electric, and they're paying anywhere from $600 to $1,000 per month just for your electric bill. That is not affordable or sustainable or equitable for anybody. So we're leaning towards in the future to have residential solar programs. Obviously, we're leaning towards EV vehicles. Some of the homes are going to need upgrades to even be able to access that and to have at-home charging stations.

So we're looking to the future, but there's a lot of foundational upgrades and resources that need to be injected in the community in order to meet those goals. So we're looking at it from a residential standpoint. What can we do as a tribal entity and a tribal government? And along with that is going to have to be changes to the policy and regulations that include a tribal model. And a lot of times that doesn't currently happen, and the regs aren't there, and it's not necessarily built for a government-to-government relationship.

GRIFFITH:

Kind of along those lines, I know that earlier this year, the California Energy Commission passed a resolution committing to tribal energy sovereignty, which was a big deal. And I'm curious, has that, do you see that resulting in these changes actually being made so that there are as better, those regs are in place and those systems are in place to actually support tribal sovereignty? Because a lot of times, I mean, I, we all get to read a lot of resolutions, right? I'm wondering what that, what those resolutions actually turn into on the ground.

JACKSON:

Yes, I think that is an absolute step in the right direction, but that's only one state entity that is approving that resolution. I don't think that that resolution has the authority then to direct the other entities, whether that's state, federal, or local, to follow suit. I'll give you a perfect example. The Hupa Valley Tribe has an executed contract with WAPA, which is the Western Area Power Administration. We get a certain allocation of energy to where we can serve the energy to specific tribal entities and businesses and not have that be a PG&E delivery point. We technically provide our allocation of energy to those 30 tribal entities. We have to pay PG&E a wholesale distribution tariff or a wheeling tariff to utilize their distribution and transmission lines.

That all seems great, but we're also paying exorbitant rates for the use of those assets. What that does, that's a DOE-WAPA government-to-government relationship and contract with a tribe, sovereign tribe, and a federal government entity. What that does is that since PG&E is not the provider or providing the energy resource, that makes us ineligible for PG&E programs when we're in PG&E territory.

The SGIP program, so we're talking about our minimart, our fire facility, our medical center. These are critical anchor institutions and they provide critical services to our community. If that is served through WAPA, through our government contract, then we can't be receiving of those program funds. I think that's a complete hindrance to tribal sovereignty and to some of the CPUC-approved programs through the investor-owned utility. That's become a barrier through most of PG&E's programs. Again, that's a conversation at the state level. That's a conversation on the reg level that basically requires a policy or statute change, which is something I'm really, really working on.

GRIFFITH:

When I think that you are like listening to you right now, you're really hitting on something that we've been talking about a lot and we talk about a lot through eco news and just like how to get information to people about what is happening now. And one of the most complex things is our energy transmission system and just how hard it is to understand how decisions are made around that, like what entity actually makes those decisions. And so that's already super complex. Right. And then if you add all these other layers on top of it, just what a hindrance that is to actually achieving tribal energy sovereignty.

JACKSON:

So we also talk about this California Public Utilities Commission, but some of these tariff decisions are happening at FERC, which is the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission. So I try and pull the tariff that is impacting some of the things that I just mentioned. It is an 800-page document. And I've already described all of the hats that I wear. Having specific energy and legal expertise is something that we need.

So I think there needs to be resources because you talk about the complexity of energy. Out of all the utilities I mentioned, the energy has been the most complex. And I've gone down these various rabbit holes because then we're talking about distribution, generation, transmission. We're looking at interconnection agreements and power purchase agreements. And we're looking at those tariffs. That is a complex beast that is way more than one person can logically handle or even understand and grasp the implications of that. So I found those resources to be really lacking because not only do you need technical expertise, you need that legal expertise and someone that really understands how tariffs and those decisions are made and how those decisions then impact tribal governments.

GRIFFITH:

And meanwhile, you just need to make sure that the medical clinic is able to like run the machines that they need to keep people alive and healthy, right? Right. I'm curious what you like thinking about the future and an ideal situation. I mean, do you have a you and your your crew at the public utilities district have a dream for like what the ideal would be? I mean, is it micro grids all over the Hoopa Valley keeping everything going?

JACKSON:

Mm-hmm. So the Hoopa Valley Reservation is one of the largest in the state of California. If you've ever been out here, we have a valley floor that there's tribal assignments, there's tribal departments, and largely our area is densely forested, mountainous acreage. And so that's really hard to build up off the valley floor. So that real estate is becoming less and less. So we have to be really mindful of the usage of land for solar or any other infrastructure and how that's going to impact future development.

WHEELER:

You, I'm sure, are already having to deal with the effects of climate change as the general manager of the utilities district. Can you talk about how you're thinking about climate change, how it's impacting the utilities district now and the things that you think about will become greater problems in the future?

JACKSON:

So this is kind of inclusive of other departments and what the tribe is doing as a whole. So I talked about densely forested land. So we're not in my department, but the tribal forestry department is looking at appropriate forest management, thinning, traditional ecological knowledge of that cultural burning practices. So there's a lot that's happening on the forest side. We have our tribal fisheries that are always leading cutting edge court definition. So we're heavy in that as well.

But if you look at it from the utility standpoint, water is going to be probably the most utilized resource. And so what I'm trying to do is looking at conservation and best management practices for not only the domestic water, which we take out of the Trinity River, but how we're diverting for irrigation because the salmonoid and the ecosystem rely on those cold streams in the summer months because the water raises temperature, the levels are lower, and we're also looking at better technology so everything is metered. So we're making sure that we're fixing leaks. We're making sure that we're really being mindful about how we're utilizing those resources.

So we're looking at it from a forestry, a cultural burning, ecosystem and fisheries management, and how we're actually using those for domestic use and for community use. It's not just coming from a tribe. It's not just utilizing the water to take a shower or do laundry. We also rely upon it for our cultural practices. We have coming of age ceremonies and traditional ceremonies that go hand in hand with water. And there's certain specific bathing areas and things that matter from a cultural and spiritual aspect as well. So it's kind of holistically looking at it for the protection of all of those things that I just mentioned.

WHEELER:

Econews. We're talking with Linnea Jackson, the General Manager of the Hoopa Valley Public Utilities District and winner of this year's Tribal Champions Award from the California Energy Commission.

GRIFFITH:

When I was kind of thinking about that, and also with the lens of talking about energy and different energy sources, and, and we are seeing right now, the dams on the Klamath River come down, the dams on the Eel River close to coming down, and just recognizing that that was, so these are power sources, right, that, that had pretty grave impacts that I think people foresaw some of them, but also seemed we didn't realize the, the extent of that.

How does the, how do you go about in your job really thinking about that, like planning for energy resilience, while also thinking about that long term? You know, we have a lot of every, every energy sources is a trade off, right? So yeah, and I know that this is, this is a really big question, I think all of us are grappling with as we shift our energy sources, as we see the offshore wind project, bubbling up out there, and just how so yeah, I'm interested if these conversations are happening as well, in your realm.

JACKSON:

Right. With climate change, we're seeing less and less snow packs in the mountains, and so that obviously affects the water runoff and the usage in the summer as well. I would be remiss if I didn't mention the CPUC allowing PG&E to raise rates to underground certain lines, but those underground lines aren't happening really in our area. There's a small section near Salyer, but essentially each customer is paying to prevent wildfires and things that happen with that. But as you know, if we're looking at the generation goals of not only a state, but this country, we will have to upgrade the entire grid within California. And what does that look like? Because we obviously have to be prepared for climate change and raising temperatures and wildfires that start, and also the cost of that.

I think within Hoopa, microgrids would go a long way. I think residential solar would really help those families provide when there's outages, hopefully mitigate cost. That's another thing that we need to look at is a financial cost analysis of really what that benefit is. So everything is about minimizing usage, right? I also think we as a community and probably as a world need to look at our energy usage and how that really impacts the overall grid. During the summers, we have these warnings of rolling blackouts in these larger areas because the temperatures are rising. People are using their AC units or they're at home. So I think we need to think about actually how we are impacting as ourselves for daily usage of energy as well.

WHEELER:

So great energy upgrades are going to be necessary for the proposed floating offshore wind. How have you been thinking about this offshore wind project, the potential downsides and also the potential benefits for the Hupa Valley Tribe? I know that you've gone in and toured other floating offshore wind facilities in Norway and have given this subject a lot of thought. So where are you landing? How are you feeling about offshore wind at this moment?

JACKSON:

So that is a complex question that I will try to unpack. I think it's been really beneficial to have a group like CORE Hub. So I am the tribal delegate that attends monthly meetings. We're present at coastal meetings like Harbor Bajor Strict, and we're looking at the policies that are coming down. So when I'm in these offshore wind working groups, again, let's unpack the complexity of it.

Obviously, we're looking at cultural site protection. We're looking at environmental protection. We're looking at migration patterns of not only the birds, but the aquatic life and the whales and the mammals. How is that gonna affect our salmon flow and the fisheries industries? And then you think about the technology, what it's going to take, what that impact is gonna have on our oceans, which obviously will domino effect into the effects to the earth and our overall ecosystem in general. So when you ask me about that, the best thing that I can do and how I feel about offshore wind is to participate, to educate myself in the ongoing studies and research that's happening.

I'm really lucky to have Schatz Energy Research Center as a partner. So we are contracted with them for several grants. We had submitted a collective grant under the California Energy Commission. Unfortunately, that wasn't awarded by DOE, which was really disappointing because we put our heart and soul into the application for over a year to make that a success. And that would have made such a great impact in California. But with that, it's those critical partners of having higher education, local institutes that are city, local governments. We're looking at working with labor unions. We're collectively working with tribes. So I think that that element has really allowed me to stay informed because it's so hard to understand and realize all of the initiatives and the meetings that are happening.

So I would say I'm cautiously optimistic. And when you ask the tough questions, what is the long-term impacts that's going to have on our environment? Nobody can really answer that question. They can do studies and they can start that data collection now. But as any researcher knows, you need at least a decade or two of data to really understand the environmental impacts that are going to happen. It's going to completely change Humboldt County as a whole. So we're looking at it from a standpoint of staying informed and educated and trying to see what benefits can come. So is there apprenticeships? Is there educational things that can happen? Hoopa has a CR branch. And so maybe they could have local classes on energy resiliency or some of the other initiatives that are going to come about as for this industry.

GRIFFITH:

I think that one thing that is helping me personally, like kind of think about all of this, this whole swirling mass of new information and unknowns and all of that is the fact that we do have such a very, very smart people locally working on this. Like you said, like yourself, like Schatz Energy Lab, that this is not something that's going to happen to us, right? That this is something that we are actively, we are watching, we are learning, and that there are so many people who are bringing that expertise to the table because it is, like you said, there's a lot of unknowns.

JACKSON:

Right. And then if you look at the country's projection on energy generation, I think by 2045, they expect to have a certain amount of that come from offshore wind. There's been federal money, there's been state money that's been invested into this. So obviously, that's kind of a pathway that's definitely in play right now. I know that there's objections because of the potential impact to what could happen to the environment. And I think if the state and the feds are pushing that, we just have to be as mindful and present as we can be.

GRIFFITH:

And throughout this process, is there any sort of like information or research or studies that you have found to be particularly helpful or any resources that you point people to who are looking for that information, whether it's about the mammal migration or transmission or or any of the pieces?

JACKSON:

That's hard because part of my role, so we have a tribal chairman and we have seven tribal council members that are elected. So part of my goal is to kind of provide them with the information that I can. Since they deal with 60 other departments and different disciplines, if I'm forwarding them the CEQA document, that might be how long. I find it better to provide a summary so they at least can be aware of that.

Because you said, you're looking at environmental, cultural, supply chain issues. Do we have the workforce? Do we have the infrastructure from roads to schools to housing? I mean, that topic is so vast that it takes more than one person. But again, I have found the reports that are done by Schatz, the reports that are being done by CEC.

So I'm kind of part of three offshore wind groups. One's COREHub, there's one that's specifically for tribes. And then there's a collective group that's everywhere from Washington all the way down. Because it's not just North Coast that's happening. Southern Oregon, it's Morro Bay, it's Washington. And I think there was another lease that was issued in the Gulf of Mexico. I didn't get to go, but there's obviously the East Coast fixed offshore wind that's happening as well, which I'd really like to see and how that's being impacted. So there's not really one resource, but having collective groups that can pool resources, different disciplines and viewpoints on it is really, really helpful.

One thing I will mention is that COREHub was able to gather some philanthropy money. So there's been small allocations for tribe because you're thinking about investing your resources, your time, you're attending meetings. All of that takes revenue to support. So I think having those resources, again, not only from a technical and legal standpoint, but having those resources for tribal staff and community to mindfully participate is also critical.

WHEELER:

Thank you to COREHub for that and for their investment in tribal energy sovereignty. So your work at the Public Utilities District is very varied, right? You're doing trash, you're doing water, energy. Is there a part of the job that you find most rewarding or maybe a part of the job that is most difficult or frustrating?

JACKSON:

Let's start with the most rewarding first. So the Hoopa Valley Tribe, I had to be remiss if I didn't say this. So we received a 65 million dollar grant from NTIA for the Tribal Broadband Connectivity Program. So we don't also struggle with with energy. It's that connectivity. So if you look at our region, we have a lack of towers. I know that there's regional broadband builds, which we're interconnecting with. Several months ago, we executed the first joint build with the California Department of Technology. All of that, all of those electronics, all of the towers need energy to provide continued continued communications.

So some of our locations, we're having to look at off grid sites. Is that a solar battery hut that's developed or can it be tied to the grid, obviously with backup generation? I know that we're trying to get away from fossil fuels. So that's why we're looking at clean energy resources. But we still need those sites to stay up and running. So my other project. So that's one of the main ones I'm really proud of is that we're doing a full fiber build out. We're building communications towers. We're training our own staff. We are a local Internet provider of mostly tribal members that are gaining expertise and tower climbing and splicing and construction. So that's another thing that I'm most proud of is working on legacy projects that will have lasting impact for the community in the region. And I think that is something that's very rewarding. So when we talk about what's a little frustrating is that I have to wear so many hats is that we don't necessarily have the resources, the office space, the training centers that we really need to make this happen.

So also in the energy world, they're looking at workforce development. They're looking at apprenticeships. Just yesterday, we had a meeting about the tax credits that you can get through the energy programs and learning about what really that looks like. You have to have your your federal rate prevailing wage scales. You have to have apprenticeships. So obviously, that comes with the facilities and the spaces to do that. So it's hard because we're understaffed. A lot of these grant opportunities don't come with a large like indirect budget or funding for for salary and fringe. So how do you how do they expect us to manage these really large scale projects but not provide the resources for the staffing or consulting that we need? So that's a bit frustrating. But as we're working through these projects and you're seeing progress, you're seeing contracts executed, you're seeing things get built. That's when it really, really pays off. And you realize your long hours and your dedication are going to mean something in the end.

WHEELER:

Well, maybe that's an excellent place to end it and all those long hours and all of that dedication have have resulted in your being awarded the Tribal Champion Award. For folks who want to tune in, there will be a link in the Lost Coast Outpost and in the show notes if you're listening to this as a podcast. And that will be December 7, from 3 to 5 p.m.. So Linnea, I'm so proud that that we get to share the North Coast with you. And it's so awesome that you're being recognized for all the good work that you do. So congratulations, and we are all here to cheer and to celebrate you.

JACKSON:

Thank you. And you know, I want to say that it's funny to me because I feel like they haven't seen anything yet. I'm not at my full potential yet.

WHEELER:

Great.

JACKSON:

Yeah.

WHEELER:

Well, thank you. And thank you, listeners, for joining us on another episode of the Econews Report. You can join us next week on this time channel for more environmental news from the North Coast of California.